Flanders 1302V15[Beta] major changes! P19

by **KingSVH** on Sat Jul 31, 2010 10:14 am

i absolutly love this map

but as somebody from the Vier Ambachten, i must point out that that region is completely misrepresented, the "Vier Ambachten" were Boekhoute, Assenede, Axel and Hulst, the first 2 are completely included in Eeklo, and the "Vier Ambachten" didn't include any land other that below the Westerschelde (and was also a part of Rijks Vlaanderen) (YAY not being French at that time

) i know this is all to late, but these historic inaccuracy do reduce the fun for locals

by **DubWarrior** on Wed Aug 11, 2010 3:01 pm

KingSVH wrote:i absolutly love this map

but as somebody from the Vier Ambachten, i must point out that that region is completely misrepresented, the "Vier Ambachten" were Boekhoute, Assenede, Axel and Hulst, the first 2 are completely included in Eeklo, and the "Vier Ambachten" didn't include any land other that below the Westerschelde (and was also a part of Rijks Vlaanderen) (YAY not being French at that time ) i know this is all to late, but these historic inaccuracy do reduce the fun for locals

Wow, thanks for adding this, just stupid we can't make it any more accurate...I did a lot of research and some borders were changed or added to certain regions for gameplay reasons...but anyway, thanks.

I'm OK with the +3 for Henegouwen! I'll make the changes as quick as possible
but my graphic software is death (some nasty tec problems) right now. Fix it asap!!!
thanks for your patience =D>

by **MrBenn** on Wed Aug 18, 2010 4:26 pm

DubWarrior wrote:d we can't make it any more accurate...I did a lot of research and some borders were changed or added to certain regions for gameplay reasons...but anyway, thanks.

I'm OK with the +3 for Henegouwen! I'll make the changes as quick as possible

The clock is ticking

by **DubWarrior** on Thu Aug 19, 2010 1:29 am

MrBenn wrote:
DubWarrior wrote:d we can't make it any more accurate...I did a lot of research and some borders were changed or added to certain regions for gameplay reasons...but anyway, thanks.

I'm OK with the +3 for Henegouwen! I'll make the changes as quick as possible

The clock is ticking

I know, my laptop battery is dead and I'm waiting for a new one, will be delevered one of these days I guess. But I have no acces to my graphic software or the xml files...didn't back-uped it :oops:

by **MegasWoman** on Thu Sep 02, 2010 12:22 pm

I love the map-good job! Just a suggestion-as JefJef and I play this map quite a bit now-could it be coded that atleast one territory in the Vier Ambachten bonus be neutral? Or it be coded that you can not drop that bonus? In two of our last three games that entire bonus has been dropped to our opponents-with them getting first turn.....

by **DubWarrior** on Fri Sep 03, 2010 4:08 am

MegasWoman wrote:I love the map-good job! Just a suggestion-as JefJef and I play this map quite a bit now-could it be coded that atleast one territory in the Vier Ambachten bonus be neutral? Or it be coded that you can not drop that bonus? In two of our last three games that entire bonus has been dropped to our opponents-with them getting first turn.....

Tnx for the reply, I personally have no idea if that is possible. I also face that problem quit a lot with Rijks-Vlaanderen. Any expert on XML who can help us out here?
:?:

by **natty dread** on Fri Sep 03, 2010 4:16 am

Yes, territories can be coded as neutrals, but you will have to take in account the starting territory count.

Alternatively you can use starting positions if a bonus only gets dropped in small games.

by **DubWarrior** on Fri Sep 03, 2010 4:52 am

natty_dread wrote:Yes, territories can be coded as neutrals, but you will have to take in account the starting territory count.

Alternatively you can use starting positions if a bonus only gets dropped in small games.

I'm not sure about both solutions. it should be a more random selection, resulting in a neutral 3 "somewhere" in Vier Ambachten, not a fixed position of the neutral or the player. This seems more like a fixed scenario and i've always tried to avoied this, pushing players in a certain play-order or starting positions...I would not like to have this finally at the end of the ride, you see.

by **natty dread** on Fri Sep 03, 2010 4:55 am

You don't need to code all territories as starting positions. For example, if the problem is only at 2-4 player games, you could code 4 starting positions into the bonus areas that are likely to get dropped. Then the map will still start as a random drop, but just those 4 territories will in 2-4 player games be distributed so that each player gets one.

by **MrBenn** on Fri Sep 03, 2010 2:16 pm

The probability of dropping Vier Ambachten is very similar (and slightly lower) than dropping all of Oceania on Classic. When people start crying for one of the territories on Classic to start neutral, I'd start worrying about making Vier Ambachten start neutral.

It would be possible to completely eliminate that chance by splitting 2 territories from the region as starting positions (so that nobody drops it on a 1v1 game), although this perversely increases the chance that one player will have three terrs on that region.

If you're worried about somebody dropping that bonus, then the best thing to do, would be to put those four terrs within starting positions, which will guarantee that nobody will drop that bonus in 2/3/4 player games. If you want to do it, the XML is incredibly simple:

Code: Select all: <positions> <position> <territory>Axel</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Hulst</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Middelburg</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Zierikzee</territory> </position> </positions>

by **DubWarrior** on Sat Sep 04, 2010 4:25 am

MrBenn wrote: When people start crying for one of the territories on Classic to start neutral, I'd start worrying about making Vier Ambachten start neutral.

If you're worried about somebody dropping that bonus, then the best thing to do, would be to put those four terrs within starting positions, which will guarantee that nobody will drop that bonus in 2/3/4 player games. If you want to do it, the XML is incredibly simple:

Code: Select all
<positions> <position> <territory>Axel</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Hulst</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Middelburg</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Zierikzee</territory> </position> </positions>

Tnx, exactly my point.
But help me out, what exactly will do this "position" tag in the XML...Makes it that all territs in Vier Ambachten are in hands of all different players? So Yes? why would you make all 4 territs so, wouldn't it be more "natural" if only 2 of them have this tag?

by **MrBenn** on Sat Sep 04, 2010 4:41 am

In a 1v1 game, this means that each player will start with two of those territories.

If you were to only include two territories in the starting position, then a) they would only be used in 2p games, and would be ignored in 3/4 player games - meaning that somebody could still drop the bonus in 3/4 player games; and b) would increase the chances of the first player dropping the remaining three territories (it's a quirk of statistics and the number of neutrals in 1v1 games), thereby making it more likely that the first player will have an easy chance to take the bonus and fort to protect it.

In 5-8 player games, it will be possible to drop the bonus, but this is much less likely than in 1v1 games, and as already said, this is less likely than dropping Oceania on the Classic map.

by **DubWarrior** on Mon Sep 13, 2010 5:00 am

Sorry for the waiting, the computer is fixed and running again, so I have again access to my files.
Latest version: changes:
-Henegouwen +3 (instead of the +2)
Files can be downloaded here:
http://www.fileden.com/files/2010/1/27/ ... OTGS4S.tif
http://www.fileden.com/files/2010/1/27/ ... OTGS4L.tif

And the changed XML, changes:
- added position-tags for Rijks Vlaanderen (Ninove, Ronse) and all territs in Vier Ambachten.
http://www.fileden.com/files/2010/1/27/ ... 092010.xml

Code: Select all: <?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?> <map> <continent> <name>Rijks-Vlaanderen</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Ninove</territory> <territory>Ronse</territory> <territory>Aalst</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Vier Ambachten</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Axel</territory> <territory>Hulst</territory> <territory>Middelburg</territory> <territory>Zierikzee</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Brabant</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Brussel</territory> <territory>Mechelen</territory> <territory>Antwerpen</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Kroon-Vlaanderen</name> <bonus>5</bonus> <components> <territory>Beveren</territory> <territory>Lokeren</territory> <territory>Gent</territory> <territory>Eeklo</territory> <territory>Roeselare</territory> <territory>Damme</territory> <territory>Ieper</territory> <territory>Poperinge</territory> <territory>Ter Duinen</territory> <territory>Broekburg</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Kortrijk</name> <bonus>4</bonus> <components> <territory>Rijsel</territory> <territory>Orchies</territory> <territory>Kortrijk</territory> <territory>Groeninge</territory> <territory>Oudenaarde</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Artesie</name> <bonus>4</bonus> <components> <territory>Lens</territory> <territory>Bethune</territory> <territory>Terwaan</territory> <territory>Kassel</territory> <territory>Sint Omaars</territory> <territory>Duinkerke</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Oostervant</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Dowaai</territory> <territory>Sint Amands</territory> <territory>Doornik</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Henegouwen</name> <bonus>3</bonus> <components> <territory>Bergen</territory> <territory>Valencijn</territory> <territory>Halle</territory> <territory>Ath</territory> </components> </continent> <territory> <name>Duinkerke</name> <borders> <border>Sint Omaars</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Broekburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>30</smallx> <smally>269</smally> <largex>36</largex> <largey>319</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Sint Omaars</name> <borders> <border>Duinkerke</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Terwaan</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>17</smallx> <smally>345</smally> <largex>23</largex> <largey>423</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Kassel</name> <borders> <border>Duinkerke</border> <border>Sint Omaars</border> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Broekburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>73</smallx> <smally>310</smally> <largex>90</largex> <largey>364</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Terwaan</name> <borders> <border>Sint Omaars</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Broekburg</border> <border>Poperinge</border> <border>Bethune</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>77</smallx> <smally>384</smally> <largex>85</largex> <largey>463</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Bethune</name> <borders> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Lens</border> <border>Arras</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>139</smallx> <smally>386</smally> <largex>169</largex> <largey>470</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Lens</name> <borders> <border>Bethune</border> <border>Rijsel</border> <border>Arras</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>206</smallx> <smally>383</smally> <largex>239</largex> <largey>448</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Arras</name> <borders> <border>Bethune</border> <border>Lens</border> <border>Rijsel</border> <border>Orchies</border> <border>Dowaai</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>231</smallx> <smally>445</smally> <largex>273</largex> <largey>524</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>5</neutral> <bonus>2</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Broekburg</name> <borders> <border>Duinkerke</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Poperinge</border> <border>Ter Duinen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>108</smallx> <smally>249</smally> <largex>132</largex> <largey>296</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Ter Duinen</name> <borders> <border>Broekburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>190</smallx> <smally>233</smally> <largex>227</largex> <largey>274</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Poperinge</name> <borders> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Broekburg</border> <border>Ieper</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>187</smallx> <smally>306</smally> <largex>217</largex> <largey>366</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Rijsel</name> <borders> <border>Lens</border> <border>Arras</border> <border>Orchies</border> <border>Ieper</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>256</smallx> <smally>361</smally> <largex>303</largex> <largey>427</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Ieper</name> <borders> <border>Poperinge</border> <border>Roeselare</border> <border>Damme</border> <border>Rijsel</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>259</smallx> <smally>303</smally> <largex>306</largex> <largey>351</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Brugge</name> <borders> <border>Damme</border> <border>Roeselare</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>319</smallx> <smally>218</smally> <largex>376</largex> <largey>250</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>4</neutral> <bonus>2</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Roeselare</name> <borders> <border>Ieper</border> <border>Damme</border> <border>Eeklo</border> <border>Kortrijk</border> <border>Brugge</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>327</smallx> <smally>281</smally> <largex>391</largex> <largey>322</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Eeklo</name> <borders> <border>Roeselare</border> <border>Gent</border> <border>Oudenaarde</border> <border>Lokeren</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>383</smallx> <smally>195</smally> <largex>458</largex> <largey>238</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Gent</name> <borders> <border>Eeklo</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>427</smallx> <smally>213</smally> <largex>504</largex> <largey>245</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Lokeren</name> <borders> <border>Eeklo</border> <border>Axel</border> <border>Hulst</border> <border>Beveren</border> <border>Aalst</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>481</smallx> <smally>209</smally> <largex>578</largex> <largey>245</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Beveren</name> <borders> <border>Lokeren</border> <border>Hulst</border> <border>Antwerpen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>549</smallx> <smally>171</smally> <largex>651</largex> <largey>205</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Damme</name> <borders> <border>Ieper</border> <border>Roeselare</border> <border>Brugge</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>259</smallx> <smally>197</smally> <largex>308</largex> <largey>231</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Kortrijk</name> <borders> <border>Roeselare</border> <border>Groeninge</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>335</smallx> <smally>339</smally> <largex>397</largex> <largey>398</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Orchies</name> <borders> <border>Rijsel</border> <border>Arras</border> <border>Dowaai</border> <border>Groeninge</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>328</smallx> <smally>384</smally> <largex>390</largex> <largey>456</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Groeninge</name> <borders> <border>Kortrijk</border> <border>Orchies</border> <border>Oudenaarde</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>381</smallx> <smally>317</smally> <largex>461</largex> <largey>365</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Oudenaarde</name> <borders> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Groeninge</border> <border>Eeklo</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>423</smallx> <smally>255</smally> <largex>501</largex> <largey>300</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Ninove</name> <borders> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Aalst</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>482</smallx> <smally>254</smally> <largex>575</largex> <largey>299</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Aalst</name> <borders> <border>Ninove</border> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Brussel</border> <border>Mechelen</border> <border>Lokeren</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>535</smallx> <smally>273</smally> <largex>634</largex> <largey>317</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Ronse</name> <borders> <border>Ath</border> <border>Halle</border> <border>Brussel</border> <border>Aalst</border> <border>Ninove</border> <border>Oudenaarde</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>453</smallx> <smally>302</smally> <largex>528</largex> <largey>354</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Axel</name> <borders> <border>Lokeren</border> <border>Hulst</border> <border>Middelburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>466</smallx> <smally>153</smally> <largex>554</largex> <largey>179</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Hulst</name> <borders> <border>Axel</border> <border>Lokeren</border> <border>Beveren</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>512</smallx> <smally>143</smally> <largex>605</largex> <largey>168</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Middelburg</name> <borders> <border>Zierikzee</border> <border>Axel</border> <border>Antwerpen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>491</smallx> <smally>94</smally> <largex>589</largex> <largey>106</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Zierikzee</name> <borders> <border>Middelburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>537</smallx> <smally>56</smally> <largex>634</largex> <largey>62</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Antwerpen</name> <borders> <border>Beveren</border> <border>Mechelen</border> <border>Middelburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>593</smallx> <smally>137</smally> <largex>706</largex> <largey>160</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Mechelen</name> <borders> <border>Brussel</border> <border>Aalst</border> <border>Antwerpen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>598</smallx> <smally>225</smally> <largex>709</largex> <largey>267</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Brussel</name> <borders> <border>Halle</border> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Aalst</border> <border>Mechelen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>591</smallx> <smally>282</smally> <largex>698</largex> <largey>339</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Ath</name> <borders> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Halle</border> <border>Doornik</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>430</smallx> <smally>347</smally> <largex>510</largex> <largey>408</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Halle</name> <borders> <border>Ath</border> <border>Brussel</border> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Doornik</border> <border>Bergen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>476</smallx> <smally>365</smally> <largex>559</largex> <largey>439</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Bergen</name> <borders> <border>Halle</border> <border>Doornik</border> <border>Valencijn</border> <border>Sint Amands</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>455</smallx> <smally>414</smally> <largex>537</largex> <largey>487</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Valencijn</name> <borders> <border>Bergen</border> <border>Sint Amands</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>436</smallx> <smally>448</smally> <largex>517</largex> <largey>530</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Doornik</name> <borders> <border>Sint Amands</border> <border>Bergen</border> <border>Halle</border> <border>Ath</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>407</smallx> <smally>412</smally> <largex>481</largex> <largey>483</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Sint Amands</name> <borders> <border>Dowaai</border> <border>Doornik</border> <border>Valencijn</border> <border>Bergen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>382</smallx> <smally>436</smally> <largex>456</largex> <largey>519</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Dowaai</name> <borders> <border>Sint Amands</border> <border>Orchies</border> <border>Arras</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>336</smallx> <smally>447</smally> <largex>398</largex> <largey>531</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <positions> <position> <territory>Axel</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Hulst</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Middelburg</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Zierikzee</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Ninove</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Ronse</territory> </position> </positions> </map>

Can someone check these tags? I have no clue if they need to have a certain fixed position in the xml or not? Hope I did it good, don't wish to make major problems while people are playing on it

Cheers

by **natty dread** on Mon Sep 13, 2010 6:33 am

Your position tags are in the wrong place... they should be in the beginning of the file.

by **DubWarrior** on Mon Sep 13, 2010 6:46 am

Before <continents>? or are they placed together with the <components>< territory > under the continents description?

by **natty dread** on Mon Sep 13, 2010 6:50 am

Yes before continents, right after "<map>".

by **DubWarrior** on Mon Sep 13, 2010 7:28 am

Hope this is better:

Code: Select all: <?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?> <map> <positions> <position> <territory>Axel</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Hulst</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Middelburg</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Zierikzee</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Ninove</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Ronse</territory> </position> </positions> <continent> <name>Rijks-Vlaanderen</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Ninove</territory> <territory>Ronse</territory> <territory>Aalst</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Vier Ambachten</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Axel</territory> <territory>Hulst</territory> <territory>Middelburg</territory> <territory>Zierikzee</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Brabant</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Brussel</territory> <territory>Mechelen</territory> <territory>Antwerpen</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Kroon-Vlaanderen</name> <bonus>5</bonus> <components> <territory>Beveren</territory> <territory>Lokeren</territory> <territory>Gent</territory> <territory>Eeklo</territory> <territory>Roeselare</territory> <territory>Damme</territory> <territory>Ieper</territory> <territory>Poperinge</territory> <territory>Ter Duinen</territory> <territory>Broekburg</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Kortrijk</name> <bonus>4</bonus> <components> <territory>Rijsel</territory> <territory>Orchies</territory> <territory>Kortrijk</territory> <territory>Groeninge</territory> <territory>Oudenaarde</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Artesie</name> <bonus>4</bonus> <components> <territory>Lens</territory> <territory>Bethune</territory> <territory>Terwaan</territory> <territory>Kassel</territory> <territory>Sint Omaars</territory> <territory>Duinkerke</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Oostervant</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Dowaai</territory> <territory>Sint Amands</territory> <territory>Doornik</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Henegouwen</name> <bonus>3</bonus> <components> <territory>Bergen</territory> <territory>Valencijn</territory> <territory>Halle</territory> <territory>Ath</territory> </components> </continent> <territory> <name>Duinkerke</name> <borders> <border>Sint Omaars</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Broekburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>30</smallx> <smally>269</smally> <largex>36</largex> <largey>319</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Sint Omaars</name> <borders> <border>Duinkerke</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Terwaan</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>17</smallx> <smally>345</smally> <largex>23</largex> <largey>423</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Kassel</name> <borders> <border>Duinkerke</border> <border>Sint Omaars</border> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Broekburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>73</smallx> <smally>310</smally> <largex>90</largex> <largey>364</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Terwaan</name> <borders> <border>Sint Omaars</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Broekburg</border> <border>Poperinge</border> <border>Bethune</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>77</smallx> <smally>384</smally> <largex>85</largex> <largey>463</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Bethune</name> <borders> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Lens</border> <border>Arras</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>139</smallx> <smally>386</smally> <largex>169</largex> <largey>470</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Lens</name> <borders> <border>Bethune</border> <border>Rijsel</border> <border>Arras</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>206</smallx> <smally>383</smally> <largex>239</largex> <largey>448</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Arras</name> <borders> <border>Bethune</border> <border>Lens</border> <border>Rijsel</border> <border>Orchies</border> <border>Dowaai</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>231</smallx> <smally>445</smally> <largex>273</largex> <largey>524</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>5</neutral> <bonus>2</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Broekburg</name> <borders> <border>Duinkerke</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Poperinge</border> <border>Ter Duinen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>108</smallx> <smally>249</smally> <largex>132</largex> <largey>296</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Ter Duinen</name> <borders> <border>Broekburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>190</smallx> <smally>233</smally> <largex>227</largex> <largey>274</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Poperinge</name> <borders> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Broekburg</border> <border>Ieper</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>187</smallx> <smally>306</smally> <largex>217</largex> <largey>366</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Rijsel</name> <borders> <border>Lens</border> <border>Arras</border> <border>Orchies</border> <border>Ieper</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>256</smallx> <smally>361</smally> <largex>303</largex> <largey>427</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Ieper</name> <borders> <border>Poperinge</border> <border>Roeselare</border> <border>Damme</border> <border>Rijsel</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>259</smallx> <smally>303</smally> <largex>306</largex> <largey>351</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Brugge</name> <borders> <border>Damme</border> <border>Roeselare</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>319</smallx> <smally>218</smally> <largex>376</largex> <largey>250</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>4</neutral> <bonus>2</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Roeselare</name> <borders> <border>Ieper</border> <border>Damme</border> <border>Eeklo</border> <border>Kortrijk</border> <border>Brugge</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>327</smallx> <smally>281</smally> <largex>391</largex> <largey>322</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Eeklo</name> <borders> <border>Roeselare</border> <border>Gent</border> <border>Oudenaarde</border> <border>Lokeren</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>383</smallx> <smally>195</smally> <largex>458</largex> <largey>238</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Gent</name> <borders> <border>Eeklo</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>427</smallx> <smally>213</smally> <largex>504</largex> <largey>245</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Lokeren</name> <borders> <border>Eeklo</border> <border>Axel</border> <border>Hulst</border> <border>Beveren</border> <border>Aalst</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>481</smallx> <smally>209</smally> <largex>578</largex> <largey>245</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Beveren</name> <borders> <border>Lokeren</border> <border>Hulst</border> <border>Antwerpen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>549</smallx> <smally>171</smally> <largex>651</largex> <largey>205</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Damme</name> <borders> <border>Ieper</border> <border>Roeselare</border> <border>Brugge</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>259</smallx> <smally>197</smally> <largex>308</largex> <largey>231</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Kortrijk</name> <borders> <border>Roeselare</border> <border>Groeninge</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>335</smallx> <smally>339</smally> <largex>397</largex> <largey>398</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Orchies</name> <borders> <border>Rijsel</border> <border>Arras</border> <border>Dowaai</border> <border>Groeninge</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>328</smallx> <smally>384</smally> <largex>390</largex> <largey>456</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Groeninge</name> <borders> <border>Kortrijk</border> <border>Orchies</border> <border>Oudenaarde</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>381</smallx> <smally>317</smally> <largex>461</largex> <largey>365</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Oudenaarde</name> <borders> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Groeninge</border> <border>Eeklo</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>423</smallx> <smally>255</smally> <largex>501</largex> <largey>300</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Ninove</name> <borders> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Aalst</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>482</smallx> <smally>254</smally> <largex>575</largex> <largey>299</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Aalst</name> <borders> <border>Ninove</border> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Brussel</border> <border>Mechelen</border> <border>Lokeren</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>535</smallx> <smally>273</smally> <largex>634</largex> <largey>317</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Ronse</name> <borders> <border>Ath</border> <border>Halle</border> <border>Brussel</border> <border>Aalst</border> <border>Ninove</border> <border>Oudenaarde</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>453</smallx> <smally>302</smally> <largex>528</largex> <largey>354</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Axel</name> <borders> <border>Lokeren</border> <border>Hulst</border> <border>Middelburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>466</smallx> <smally>153</smally> <largex>554</largex> <largey>179</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Hulst</name> <borders> <border>Axel</border> <border>Lokeren</border> <border>Beveren</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>512</smallx> <smally>143</smally> <largex>605</largex> <largey>168</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Middelburg</name> <borders> <border>Zierikzee</border> <border>Axel</border> <border>Antwerpen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>491</smallx> <smally>94</smally> <largex>589</largex> <largey>106</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Zierikzee</name> <borders> <border>Middelburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>537</smallx> <smally>56</smally> <largex>634</largex> <largey>62</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Antwerpen</name> <borders> <border>Beveren</border> <border>Mechelen</border> <border>Middelburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>593</smallx> <smally>137</smally> <largex>706</largex> <largey>160</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Mechelen</name> <borders> <border>Brussel</border> <border>Aalst</border> <border>Antwerpen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>598</smallx> <smally>225</smally> <largex>709</largex> <largey>267</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Brussel</name> <borders> <border>Halle</border> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Aalst</border> <border>Mechelen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>591</smallx> <smally>282</smally> <largex>698</largex> <largey>339</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Ath</name> <borders> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Halle</border> <border>Doornik</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>430</smallx> <smally>347</smally> <largex>510</largex> <largey>408</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Halle</name> <borders> <border>Ath</border> <border>Brussel</border> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Doornik</border> <border>Bergen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>476</smallx> <smally>365</smally> <largex>559</largex> <largey>439</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Bergen</name> <borders> <border>Halle</border> <border>Doornik</border> <border>Valencijn</border> <border>Sint Amands</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>455</smallx> <smally>414</smally> <largex>537</largex> <largey>487</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Valencijn</name> <borders> <border>Bergen</border> <border>Sint Amands</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>436</smallx> <smally>448</smally> <largex>517</largex> <largey>530</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Doornik</name> <borders> <border>Sint Amands</border> <border>Bergen</border> <border>Halle</border> <border>Ath</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>407</smallx> <smally>412</smally> <largex>481</largex> <largey>483</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Sint Amands</name> <borders> <border>Dowaai</border> <border>Doornik</border> <border>Valencijn</border> <border>Bergen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>382</smallx> <smally>436</smally> <largex>456</largex> <largey>519</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Dowaai</name> <borders> <border>Sint Amands</border> <border>Orchies</border> <border>Arras</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>336</smallx> <smally>447</smally> <largex>398</largex> <largey>531</largey> </coordinates> </territory> </map>

http://www.fileden.com/files/2010/1/27/2739987/xml13092010.xml

cheers

by **natty dread** on Mon Sep 13, 2010 7:32 am

Yep it seems good now.

by **iancanton** on Thu Sep 16, 2010 2:33 am

u have 6 start positions. did u really want to do that? with 6 positions, a 2-player game is likely to start with one player holding 3 of the vier ambachten regions.

if u use only 4 start positions by removing ninove and ronse, then both will start with 2 of the vier ambachten regions.

for those interested, room 24 of the plantin-moretus museum (which i rate as antwerp's top museum) has a nice collection of old maps, including maps of the southern netherlands that cover the same area as our map, as well as maps produced by mercator, the famous flemish cartographer.

http://www.museumplantinmoretus.be/eCache/MFE/30/04/926.html

ian.

by **DubWarrior** on Thu Sep 16, 2010 3:00 am

iancanton wrote:u have 6 start positions. did u really want to do that? with 6 positions, a 2-player game is likely to start with one player holding 3 of the vier ambachten regions.

if u use only 4 start positions by removing ninove and ronse, then both will start with 2 of the vier ambachten regions.

Ah, nope didn't know that. I was thinking of dividing the territs of Vier ambachten amongst different players, and do the same for Rijks-Vlaanderen (with the 3th territory of aalst starting as neutral). Not dividing those 6 territs amongst different players.
You get the difference?
But these is no way to write that efficient and working?

for those interested, room 24 of the plantin-moretus museum (which i rate as antwerp's top museum) has a nice collection of old maps, including maps of the southern netherlands that cover the same area as our map, as well as maps produced by mercator, the famous flemish cartographer.

http://www.museumplantinmoretus.be/eCache/MFE/30/04/926.html

ian.

Hehe, great. Love that museum, one of the best collections for typography and cartography, a real dream.
they give some real nice workshops and lectures on typo.
glad you know it

by **ender516** on Thu Sep 16, 2010 8:40 am

You could also divide Oostervant as you have Rijks-Vlaanderen. Create four starting positions, each with two territories: one from Vier Ambachten, and one from either Oostervant or Rijks-Vlaanderen. That should smooth things out.

by **DubWarrior** on Fri Sep 17, 2010 2:34 am

<map>
<positions>
<position>
<territory>Zierikzee</territory>
</position>
<position>
<territory>Axel</territory>
</position>
<position>
<territory>Dowaai</territory>
</position>
<position>
<territory>Ronse</territory>
</position>
</positions>

Something like this,
sorry for my noob comments, but never did this before

thx for the patience

by **ender516** on Fri Sep 17, 2010 8:07 am

No, I meant this:

Code: Select all: <positions> <position> <territory>Axel</territory> <territory>Sint Amands</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Hulst</territory> <territory>Ninove</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Middelburg</territory> <territory>Dowaai</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Zierikzee</territory> <territory>Ronse</territory> </position> </positions>

The bonus regions are all divided, and I have tried to pair them so that each set is fair: Zierikzee is easy to defend with one border, but it is balanced by Ronse, with six borders (one of which starts neutral). I put these pairs together fairly quickly, so any suggestions about swaps are welcome. Just keep the Vier Ambachten regions spread out, one to each position.

by **DubWarrior** on Fri Sep 17, 2010 8:28 am

I've added them, all fine now?

Code: Select all: <?xml version="1.0" encoding="UTF-8"?> <map> <positions> <position> <territory>Axel</territory> <territory>Sint Amands</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Hulst</territory> <territory>Ninove</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Middelburg</territory> <territory>Dowaai</territory> </position> <position> <territory>Zierikzee</territory> <territory>Ronse</territory> </position> </positions> <continent> <name>Rijks-Vlaanderen</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Ninove</territory> <territory>Ronse</territory> <territory>Aalst</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Vier Ambachten</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Axel</territory> <territory>Hulst</territory> <territory>Middelburg</territory> <territory>Zierikzee</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Brabant</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Brussel</territory> <territory>Mechelen</territory> <territory>Antwerpen</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Kroon-Vlaanderen</name> <bonus>5</bonus> <components> <territory>Beveren</territory> <territory>Lokeren</territory> <territory>Gent</territory> <territory>Eeklo</territory> <territory>Roeselare</territory> <territory>Damme</territory> <territory>Ieper</territory> <territory>Poperinge</territory> <territory>Ter Duinen</territory> <territory>Broekburg</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Kortrijk</name> <bonus>4</bonus> <components> <territory>Rijsel</territory> <territory>Orchies</territory> <territory>Kortrijk</territory> <territory>Groeninge</territory> <territory>Oudenaarde</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Artesie</name> <bonus>4</bonus> <components> <territory>Lens</territory> <territory>Bethune</territory> <territory>Terwaan</territory> <territory>Kassel</territory> <territory>Sint Omaars</territory> <territory>Duinkerke</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Oostervant</name> <bonus>2</bonus> <components> <territory>Dowaai</territory> <territory>Sint Amands</territory> <territory>Doornik</territory> </components> </continent> <continent> <name>Henegouwen</name> <bonus>3</bonus> <components> <territory>Bergen</territory> <territory>Valencijn</territory> <territory>Halle</territory> <territory>Ath</territory> </components> </continent> <territory> <name>Duinkerke</name> <borders> <border>Sint Omaars</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Broekburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>30</smallx> <smally>269</smally> <largex>36</largex> <largey>319</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Sint Omaars</name> <borders> <border>Duinkerke</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Terwaan</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>17</smallx> <smally>345</smally> <largex>23</largex> <largey>423</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Kassel</name> <borders> <border>Duinkerke</border> <border>Sint Omaars</border> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Broekburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>73</smallx> <smally>310</smally> <largex>90</largex> <largey>364</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Terwaan</name> <borders> <border>Sint Omaars</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Broekburg</border> <border>Poperinge</border> <border>Bethune</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>77</smallx> <smally>384</smally> <largex>85</largex> <largey>463</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Bethune</name> <borders> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Lens</border> <border>Arras</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>139</smallx> <smally>386</smally> <largex>169</largex> <largey>470</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Lens</name> <borders> <border>Bethune</border> <border>Rijsel</border> <border>Arras</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>206</smallx> <smally>383</smally> <largex>239</largex> <largey>448</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Arras</name> <borders> <border>Bethune</border> <border>Lens</border> <border>Rijsel</border> <border>Orchies</border> <border>Dowaai</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>231</smallx> <smally>445</smally> <largex>273</largex> <largey>524</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>5</neutral> <bonus>2</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Broekburg</name> <borders> <border>Duinkerke</border> <border>Kassel</border> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Poperinge</border> <border>Ter Duinen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>108</smallx> <smally>249</smally> <largex>132</largex> <largey>296</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Ter Duinen</name> <borders> <border>Broekburg</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>190</smallx> <smally>233</smally> <largex>227</largex> <largey>274</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Poperinge</name> <borders> <border>Terwaan</border> <border>Broekburg</border> <border>Ieper</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>187</smallx> <smally>306</smally> <largex>217</largex> <largey>366</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Rijsel</name> <borders> <border>Lens</border> <border>Arras</border> <border>Orchies</border> <border>Ieper</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>256</smallx> <smally>361</smally> <largex>303</largex> <largey>427</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Ieper</name> <borders> <border>Poperinge</border> <border>Roeselare</border> <border>Damme</border> <border>Rijsel</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>259</smallx> <smally>303</smally> <largex>306</largex> <largey>351</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Brugge</name> <borders> <border>Damme</border> <border>Roeselare</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>319</smallx> <smally>218</smally> <largex>376</largex> <largey>250</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>4</neutral> <bonus>2</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Roeselare</name> <borders> <border>Ieper</border> <border>Damme</border> <border>Eeklo</border> <border>Kortrijk</border> <border>Brugge</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>327</smallx> <smally>281</smally> <largex>391</largex> <largey>322</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Eeklo</name> <borders> <border>Roeselare</border> <border>Gent</border> <border>Oudenaarde</border> <border>Lokeren</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>383</smallx> <smally>195</smally> <largex>458</largex> <largey>238</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Gent</name> <borders> <border>Eeklo</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>427</smallx> <smally>213</smally> <largex>504</largex> <largey>245</largey> </coordinates> <neutral>3</neutral> <bonus>1</bonus> </territory> <territory> <name>Lokeren</name> <borders> <border>Eeklo</border> <border>Axel</border> <border>Hulst</border> <border>Beveren</border> <border>Aalst</border> </borders> <coordinates> 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</borders> <coordinates> <smallx>598</smallx> <smally>225</smally> <largex>709</largex> <largey>267</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Brussel</name> <borders> <border>Halle</border> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Aalst</border> <border>Mechelen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>591</smallx> <smally>282</smally> <largex>698</largex> <largey>339</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Ath</name> <borders> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Halle</border> <border>Doornik</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>430</smallx> <smally>347</smally> <largex>510</largex> <largey>408</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Halle</name> <borders> <border>Ath</border> <border>Brussel</border> <border>Ronse</border> <border>Doornik</border> <border>Bergen</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>476</smallx> <smally>365</smally> <largex>559</largex> <largey>439</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Bergen</name> <borders> 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<smally>436</smally> <largex>456</largex> <largey>519</largey> </coordinates> </territory> <territory> <name>Dowaai</name> <borders> <border>Sint Amands</border> <border>Orchies</border> <border>Arras</border> </borders> <coordinates> <smallx>336</smallx> <smally>447</smally> <largex>398</largex> <largey>531</largey> </coordinates> </territory> </map>

http://www.fileden.com/files/2010/1/27/2739987/xml17092010.xml

by **MrBenn** on Mon Sep 27, 2010 4:34 pm

http://www.fileden.com/files/2010/1/27/2739987/xml17092010.xml

Was it just the addition of starting positions that have been changed?

Flanders 1302V15[Beta] major changes! P19

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

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Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

Re: Flanders 1302V14 [D][Gp][G][XML][Beta]

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