[Abandoned] - New Zealand

by **Ethitts** on Sun Sep 07, 2008 1:39 am

Don't have lines of attack, have ports/docks. It makes things less messy

by **reggie_mac** on Mon Sep 08, 2008 2:09 am

Problem with that is all of the ports/docks can attack each other, and i was kinda trying to avoid doing that, it would play like the map i printed out and i thought the number of places to attack to-from was a bit over the top. Something to look into again though, i will look at options of placings for them.

Cheers for the feedback.

by **Ethitts** on Mon Sep 08, 2008 2:11 pm

You could just do west ports can attack each other, east ports can attack each other and then have a North, South, East, West bearing on the map.

by **reggie_mac** on Mon Sep 08, 2008 3:33 pm

If i were to put them on, they would be on

Auckland
Waikato
Wellington
Canterbury
Otago

This may play out ok, but im going to have to remove the Wellington-Tasman link. Will mock it up and print it out for a test play and let you know how it pans out.. the more im looking at it the more i like the idea.

by **MrBenn** on Mon Sep 08, 2008 4:49 pm

The graphics on this map look good ;-)

I can appreciate that Rugby is a big NZ sport, but am not convinced that the fusion you've got will have a wider appeal... I think you'd have more success focusing on the geographical aspects of the map and toning down (possibly even losing) the rugby theme.

by **ZeakCytho** on Mon Sep 08, 2008 6:01 pm

MrBenn wrote:I can appreciate that Rugby is a big NZ sport, but am not convinced that the fusion you've got will have a wider appeal... I think you'd have more success focusing on the geographical aspects of the map and toning down (possibly even losing) the rugby theme.

That's exactly how I feel about it. Not being from NZ, and having no idea how Rugby is played, I have much less interest in this map than if it were a geographical representation of NZ.

by **reggie_mac** on Mon Sep 08, 2008 8:07 pm

These are not just areas of rugby, the map is also a representation of geographical/geopolitical/tourism areas in New Zealand, i could drop the whole rugby from the title and re-name the bonus areas to something different and the map would still be viable. The rugby theme came about as it thought it may have a wider appeal to players and because it is a significant aspect within New Zealand itself. In saying that im not 100% fixed on keeping it as the game theme, if it needs to change to make the cut then I've no problems doing it. Thats also one of the reasons I haven't made anything more of the divisions.

I must say i've not though much about other themes so if anyones got any ideas...

by **Ethitts** on Tue Sep 09, 2008 12:23 am

I think a rugby theme is all good, but honestly, I would just prefer it as a geographical map. Chuck up a poll and see what the community thinks.

by **reggie_mac** on Tue Sep 09, 2008 3:44 am

Will do, but i think i'll just drop all theme references for now and concentrate on getting the game play sorted first. Then i'll try to come up with a few different themes i can base it around and take a poll.

by **milner94** on Tue Sep 09, 2008 2:59 pm

Three things.

I lived in New Zealand for a year, so I suggested this map. I suggested a more geographical map, with the Southern Alps factoring in it. See viewtopic.php?f=63&t=57025&p=1461237#p1461237

Secondly, when I posted that up, wcaclimbing replied saying he was already doing a map as a sort of step-by-step tutorial.

Thirdly, I don't see the point in the Rugby element, personally. Conquer Club has quite a few members, but I doubt many of them like both New Zealand and Rugby. I think the map would have very limited appeal.

In all, I think you and wcaclimbing should collaborate on this. Also, I think the map in my thread is a pretty good basis. I would really like to see a New Zealand map, but preferably without rugby.

by **n8dog** on Thu Sep 11, 2008 12:09 am

milner94 wrote:Secondly, when I posted that up, wcaclimbing replied saying he was already doing a map as a sort of step-by-step tutorial.

Yeah, 2 years ago and 3 posts.... Yawn

milner94 wrote:Thirdly, I don't see the point in the Rugby element, personally. Conquer Club has quite a few members, but I doubt many of them like both New Zealand and Rugby. I think the map would have very limited appeal.

As a theme, it has great merit. It could be expanded in the sense that there could come in the future 2 more maps, Australia and South Africa, continuing the theme. Would make an awesome tournament, one that any rugger-head would find interest in.

There are plenty other maps with themes in CC, so I see no reason to get rid of the rugby element.

Regarding the connections between territories, I've always been in favour of each provincial headquarters (eg: Otago vs Auckland, Waikato, Wellington and Canterbury) being able to attack all other headquarters, like docks and ports but without the naval terminology.

by **reggie_mac** on Thu Sep 11, 2008 1:31 am

milner94 wrote:I lived in New Zealand for a year, so I suggested this map. I suggested a more geographical map, with the Southern Alps factoring in it. See viewtopic.php?f=63&t=57025&p=1461237#p1461237

Yeah, and I'm from New Zealand. Basically my map is based around areas or population base or what ever, as a country itself the geographic idea could work, but not what i wanted to do. I did think of going with a map generated from actual terrain data 3d and everything, but basically couldn't be arsed.

My idea came from this thread http://www.conquerclub.com/forum/viewtopic.php?f=63&t=60086 so don't think im stealing your idea or anything as i didn't know yours was there. (didn't search the scrap heap)

I've talked to wcaclimbing and it turns out he is making a tutorial using NZ as a base not making a NZ map itself, so I'm going to keep going ahead and also help him out with his project.

milner94 wrote:Thirdly, I don't see the point in the Rugby element, personally. Conquer Club has quite a few members, but I doubt many of them like both New Zealand and Rugby. I think the map would have very limited appeal.

And well the point in having a New Zealand map with a rugby theme is that people who like New Zealand or Rugby would have a map to play on.

by **milner94** on Thu Sep 11, 2008 11:49 am

Fair enough. I'd probably play on the map anyway, nice to see someone trying to get at least one map up here. I'd do it myself but wouldn't know where to start with all the coding and graphics. I just felt a more geographical map would appeal to a wider audience. I might have a go at doing everything, but don't quite know how to do anything. I looked at the tutorials but I still don't how to start. I don't hold anything against you for "copying", as you probably started first, and anyway I only suggested it. However, I would like to see a geographical one as well. Maybe we will end up with two maps!

by **MrBenn** on Thu Sep 11, 2008 3:22 pm

reggie_mac wrote:And well the point in having a New Zealand map with a rugby theme is that people who like New Zealand or Rugby would have a map to play on.

I'm not sure that combining the two will give your map wider appeal...
Consider this:

by **reggie_mac** on Thu Sep 11, 2008 4:44 pm

reggie_mac wrote:Will do, but i think i'll just drop all theme references for now and concentrate on getting the game play sorted first. Then i'll try to come up with a few different themes i can base it around and take a poll.

Ok, there is No Theme anymore, im working on something at the moment and hope to have it up later today

by **MrBenn** on Fri Sep 12, 2008 10:01 am

A geographical New Zealand map makes more sense to me... looking forward to seeing your draft ;-)

by **reggie_mac** on Fri Sep 12, 2008 5:01 pm

Border sizes have been increased to fit the 88's properly and cleaned up a little, text moved off some territories to clear them up a bit.

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3165/2851069751_85ccb0e4f2_o.jpg

I'm still stuck with lines of attack, i looked into the 'ports' thing but I am concerned that it is just going to turn the game into a free for all, It just allows for too many variables and what i would call 'untidy' play. The problem is i can't just have the link between Wellington/Tasman as it would create a major choke point. So im going to leave the Wellington-Tasman link, but im not sure about how to do another one. I've put Northland/Southland on this map but other options are avaliable. either from Southland or Otago going to Auckland or Northland or North Habour.

by **gho** on Sat Sep 13, 2008 10:54 am

Youve got black and Dark Blue worth the same even though dark blue has 2 less territories, to fix this you should add stewart island as a territory connected to southland. Also to make it a bit more difficult for players, maybe there should be a negative bonus if you hold all of the North Island or South Island (you would have a massive bonus with only 2 countries to defend).

Also after tonights game Im glad you got rid of the rugby theme. God it was close, but a few stupid decisions by the aussie players have lost us the tri-nations.

by **reggie_mac** on Sat Sep 13, 2008 8:00 pm

im planning on bringing stewart island into play, as well as adding chatam islands and great barrier island, these would be used to solve the lines of attack problem as well.

But what a game it was, i though the Aussies might have snuck away with it there.

by **milner94** on Sun Sep 14, 2008 3:15 am

I like it so far! Keep up the good work, but two things I think you should do.

Firstly, add Stewart Island.

Secondly, remove the Northland-Southland link, simply because it is highly unrealistic. What I would recommend doing is splitting Tasman into Nelson and Marlborough, or Tasman and Nelson, or whatever, so you have two territories side by side at the top of North Island. Assume we call them Nelson (on the left) and Marlborough (on the right). You would still have the current link between Marlborough and Wellington, but you'd also have one between Nelson and Wanganui. Do you get me? That way there'd be two borders between each of the islands, and it would still be a realistic map.

Also, just me being picky, the colours aren't very soothing on the eye. They're not bad, I just think they could be better.

by **reggie_mac** on Mon Sep 15, 2008 5:56 pm

Concept J

http://farm4.static.flickr.com/3272/2856410007_185b4aae10_o.jpg

Question : Is the link from Tasman to Wanganui ok, or should it be Tasman to Taranaki.

On another note, I got the DEM (Digital Elevation Mapping) data for NZ and compiled and shaded it. It looks, well messy. Just due to the physical size of NZ and what its got going on doesn't look like it works too well. I might try to do some stuff with a gray scale image but im not overly confident about it at this stage. I'll try to get some samples up later tonight.

I'm going to leave the colours as they are for now, I'll move onto that once i've got the territories/links etc worked up properly.

I'm also going to add Fiordland to bring the numbers in the dark blue territories up so the bonus 3 men makes more sense.

by **gho** on Tue Sep 16, 2008 1:26 am

Would be nice to see what the DEM looks like

I think with the northland southland connection Dark Blues bonus is alright. You might want to lighten the latitude and longitude lines.

by **Ethitts** on Tue Sep 16, 2008 2:40 am

Looking good, those latitude and longitude lines need fixing though. Also, make lake Taupo bigger so it has an affect on gameplay.

by **milner94** on Fri Sep 19, 2008 11:16 am

I think it's shaping up great. I agree, the longitude/latitude lines need to lighten, and now you mention it, it may be better having the route Nelson-Taranaki. It'll look neater, for one thing.

I'm not sure you need to make Taupo bigger. I doubt it would make much difference in a real life war. I suppose I think the same way about the Southern Alps. It would be nice to have them feature in some way, but it just doesn't suit the territories. Unless you stretch West Coast down to where your going to put fiordland, put the Alps along the centre, and add the three passes from the West Coast to the relevant countries.

I do agree that you need to add Fiordland, firstly because it's an area in its own right, and also because its the only way the bonus will make sense.

Also I notice Northland is slightly misshapen around the Bay of Islands side. Is it just like that due to the original image? Obviously, it would look better if you fixed it, but if it would be hard then it's not too much of a problem.

Another thought - Otago and Nth. Otago are a bit sort of out of proportion. Maybe you could stretch Nth. Otago down so its border was from just above the Otago Peninsula to the end of West Coast. It wouldn't change any borders, but it may be better to call Otago "Sth. Otago".

Lastly, is there any particular reason for the route of the Marlborough-Wellington link being like that? You could get rid of the slightly confusing wiggle by going from the east coast of Marlborough rather than from the north.

Of course, you don't have to include everything I suggest. These are only suggestions, after all. Other people have their own opinions, and so do you. And you are the map maker here. So I apologize for the rather long post, but keep up the good work!

by **reggie_mac** on Fri Sep 19, 2008 8:21 pm

Right,

Firstly, there is a very heavy graphics update on the way. I've been playing with the DEM and i've got somehting i think is looking pretty damed fine. Its also thrown up a nice new theme idea too.

I'm pretty sure im heading in the right direction because most things that are being thrown up i've picked up on too, so hopefully i may even get an idea stamp soon.

I think it's shaping up great. I agree, the longitude/latitude lines need to lighten, and now you mention it, it may be better having the route Nelson-Taranaki. It'll look neater, for one thing.

Don't worry guys, those line are changing :oops:

. and yes the route will change to Nelson-taranaki as its a more legit link

I'm not sure you need to make Taupo bigger. I doubt it would make much difference in a real life war. I suppose I think the same way about the Southern Alps. It would be nice to have them feature in some way, but it just doesn't suit the territories. Unless you stretch West Coast down to where your going to put fiordland, put the Alps along the centre, and add the three passes from the West Coast to the relevant countries.

I agree about the lake, but im thinking of modifying some borders in the north island to tidy them up a bit, im just not feeling like they gell at the moment.

The southern Alps well now feature a bit more than before on the map, but still not much. In fact the whole graphic's outlay is being heavily modified so it may scoot off in a different direction entirely now.

I do agree that you need to add Fiordland, firstly because it's an area in its own right, and also because its the only way the bonus will make sense.

Well, technically its part of southland, but worthy of the spot to get the bonuses right, so i've already added it to the update.

Also I notice Northland is slightly misshapen around the Bay of Islands side. Is it just like that due to the original image? Obviously, it would look better if you fixed it, but if it would be hard then it's not too much of a problem.

Too many layers and the original map i had wasn't the flashest starting point, but taken care of now

Another thought - Otago and Nth. Otago are a bit sort of out of proportion. Maybe you could stretch Nth. Otago down so its border was from just above the Otago Peninsula to the end of West Coast. It wouldn't change any borders, but it may be better to call Otago "Sth. Otago".

Yeah, Otago is a bit all over the place like that, like i live in the Otago area, but our hospital is run by the Southland district (Ambo's are otago though), so im kinda just doing what i can.

Lastly, is there any particular reason for the route of the Marlborough-Wellington link being like that? You could get rid of the slightly confusing wiggle by going from the east coast of Marlborough rather than from the north.

Yup, and its not really subject to change. Its the route of the Inter Islander, to only real legitimate link between the north and south island.

[Abandoned] - New Zealand

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